Recently, I was reading a book on the human body, specifically the nervous system and the brain. It was really cool to see the human body laid out and explained. I like seeing how things connect and interact to cause the human body to function. And while I'll get no argument from atheists on the how and why the human body functions, the definitive why is where we suddenly find ourselves on opposite ends of the same bridge, AND YET, somehow we're (theists) are denied of ever having been on the bridge. The bridge of course is science. The opposition is our belief as theists that we were created and despite agreeing with every single why & how of nature, the human body, and even the world, because we posit a conscious creator we are Anti-Science. Is this not intellectually dishonest if we affirm the exact science behind something and yet posit a different theory on how the something came to be? I'll get back to this in a moment but allow me to put my Christianity back on and address a few things.
I think the chasm between science and Christianity exists because of the many misconceptions within it that have unfortunately become popular arguments. So to make this discussion easier for the both of us I'll address a few of those common misconceptions:
THE BIBLE DOES NOT TEACHES THE EARTH IS FLAT
Grabbing a handful of verses in The Bible we can see a clear use of certain terminologies (Isa 11:12, Rev 7:1, Job 38:4-13, Jer 16:19, Dan 4:11, Psa 104:5, 93:1, 96:10) such as "the foundations of the earth", "the four corners of the earth" or "the whole earth" ect. ect. It's easy for anyone to point and declare The Bible ridiculous based on that criteria. However, there are certain things people don't care to look into a bother to learn, for example Isaiah, Job, Jeremiah and Psalms are written as forms of poetry or in prose form (any study Bible makes this fact known to the reader). For example also found in The Bible are verses that say;
“For you will go out with joy
And be led forth with peace;
The mountains and the hills will break forth into shouts of joy before you,
And all the trees of the field will clap their hands." - Isa 55:12
And yet, Atheists don't go around saying that Christians believe Trees have hands and Mountains have mouths to shout. Why is that? Because Atheists understand the concept for personification. A literary device that gives the traits of a person to objects in order to convey a point. "The sun was smiling, the winter was bitter..." you get the idea. So when The Bible talks about "the four corners of earth" or "ends of the earth" it's not suggesting that the Earth has four corners or a specific end point, rather it's an eidom from their society that used to signify a great distance in many directions. So to say that The Bible teaches The Earth is flat is dishonest and an exaggeration of the meaning of the text.
But what about books like Daniel and Revelation that aren't poetic? Well, the same thing applies. When God talks about laying the foundations of the Earth, He is NOT saying the Earth has a foundation, He is using metaphorical imagery to convey His absolute authority over the Earth. It's the same when people say "I built this company from the ground up.". Were we to take that sentence literally it makes absolutely NO sense whatsoever. OR do we take that sentence to mean this person has started said company from the very beginning? I think everyone would agree on the latter as being the most accurate way to understand that sentence. In short, The Bible does not teach The Earth is flat anymore than it teaches mountains have vocal cords and trees have hands. Still, after years and years of proving time and time again The Bible doesn't teach this there are still some who will parrot this argument over and over. However, you cannot say you did not hear an objection to it.
THE BIBLE DOES NOT TEACHES ALL ILLNESS ARE THE CAUSE OF DEMONS
This isn't common but I've heard this enough to put it here and I have NO clue where they get this idea from. First of all, does The Bible talk about demon possession? Yes. But does it teach that ALL illnesses are because of demons? ABSOLUTELY NOT! There are only 2 instances of demon possession in The Bible and neither of them discuss any exact symptoms of what a demon possessed people would look and act like, The demon possessed boy Jesus helped was prone to seizures, while the man Jesus helped was wailing and cutting himself. Those are the ONLY two cases of demon possession. However, The Bible has SEVERAL cases of people having sicknesses that AREN'T attributed to demons. Jesus healing the leper, the blind, a woman suffering from hemophilia, the paralyzed and so on so forth. Not in any of those moments will you see Jesus or the apostles attribute their sicknesses to demons.
And since we're on topic, The Bible does NOT teach against modern medicine or condemn it. Considering the fact that Luke himself was a physician, it's safe to say that The Bible understood medical methods of healing. I'll elaborate on this later.
MIRACLES IN THE BIBLE
The only aspect of The Bible that are anti-science are the miracles, but in their very being of being anti-science they're actually affirming science. How? Simple, a miracle isn't a miracle that occurs naturally. For example, water does not transform into wine. If Jesus merely poured a basin of water into another basin of water well then what'd be the point in that? But since everyone knows water is not wine and wine is not water (because scientifically they're two different things) when water does become wine, people are amazed. Jesus' ability to do things that combat the natural order of things is a very solid showcase of His control over that natural order. We cannot walk on water unless it's solidified by extremely cold temperatures and yet Jesus can walk on water anytime He wishes. So while I affirm that the miracles are anti-science, the very fact that they're referred to as miracles and not the natural order of things affirms the existence of a natural order of things. Therefore when people attempt to explain the miracles scientifically and fail to do so they complain, not realizing that the very nature of a miracle is to go against science.
THE BIBLE IS NOT ANTI-SCIENCE
Outside of the miracles, The Bible makes NO claims that have been disputed scientifically. The Bible makes no claim about how lightning is formed, how babies are made, ect. ect. If The Bible were to tell us that lightning is God hurling thunderbolts down at the ground or (a popular one) angel's bowling, that'd make The Bible 100% wrong. But The Bible does not make any claim in regards to that. The Bible simply says that God is responsible for thunder & lightning and how babies are made ect. ect. but The Bible doesn't elaborate on any exact process.
Now that that's over I can take off my Christian hat and once again address you as just a simple Theist. I think we can all agree that The Human Body is a system. Food goes in, waste comes out. Blood is the fuel and the brain and heart are basically the engines. Our Earth is a system...in fact our galaxy, The Solar System IS A SYSTEM! Each planet has a specific function that if it wasn't where it was in our solar system, Earth would be screwed. Systems exist all around us. They are time tested events that we can always count on. When December rolls around we can always count on it being colder than July, why ? Because the Earth is farther from the sun. WE KNOW THIS! We theists are not denying this either, all we are doing is positing a system designer. Let me switch gears a little bit and use an example I've wanted to use for awhile.
This is a vending machine (obviously...and a very high priced on at that, $ 5.50 FOR CHIPS?!). The Vending Machine is undeniably a system of levers and pullies and cogs and circuits and everything else. Each one works in harmony that results in your snack being dispensed below. Two people could look at this vending machine and ask "How does this work?". Well, you insert the monetary requirement for the snack you desire in the slot, use the keypad to insert the numerical and alphabetical address for the snack, a series of coils releases the snack and it's dispensed below for you to receive and consume at your leisure. "No, but HOW does it work?" Oh, well you see inside the machines are circuits that are wired to receive signals from things called receivers, each receiver responds to a different numerical and alphabetical address that's why you won't get Snickers if you were trying to get a Kit-Kat. Also the machine has a scanner inside of it, so it can read the serial number on the dollar you gave it to calculate if you inserted the amount required to purchase the item. "How?" Well, someone in a company somewhere sat down with a sheet of paper and a ruler and a pencil and designed the vending machine and some programmers got together and programmed the receivers inside of it and everything else, then they hooked up some snack food companies and agreed to carry their products and that's how? "Why?". Probably because someone wanted to be able to eat snack foods on the go or maybe they wanted people who had pocket change to at least get something to put in their stomachs.
The Vending Machine portion of this wasn't to insult your intelligence, but just to talk about something on a much larger scale on a very small scale level...if that makes any sense. What I'm saying is that Theists and Atheists can look at The Vending Machine and affirm the circuits, receivers and so on so forth BUT Theists affirm the programmers and the snack food company and the guy with pencil, paper and ruler. However, the sad thing is there are some atheists who would say fairies and pixies magically know which product you want and release it and think that would be a more accurate depiction of what we believe. That's dishonest. And this is where I think the conversation has completely gone off the rails. I look at the human body and I see how impressive it is, I see design and YET somehow my seeing design instantly makes me against science. Simply because I see a design in our existence, EVEN when I see how the nervous system functions, EVEN if I KNOW for a fact that the Earth is round, EVEN if I KNOW that a leaf falling on me wouldn't kill me because the speed in which the leaf traveled didn't produce enough force to knock me over and a leaf isn't dense enough to cause me physical harm, EVEN if I KNOW about the doppler effect and atoms and viruses, EVEN if I know all of these things BECAUSE I SEE THEM AS DESIGN, I am considered anti-science. Because I posit a conscious Designer.
So, are we talking past each other? Have we been so enamored with bad examples of each other that we've gotten to the point where we can't have an honest discussion about a Designer? I love science. One of my first obsessions was outer space, heck, I still love outer space! The more I read in the realm of science and so on, the more I'm amazed on the design of this universe. But because I used the word "design" I'm not to be taken seriously. I've never encountered anything that would explicitly point to "There is no God." and I am VERY interested as to what you think does point to there not being a God. There are still many in the scientific community who hold to evolution but have a VERY different idea on how it began. Some think asteroids, others think rain, big bang, ect. ect. And I've actually ran into someone who ACTUALLY and I am not kidding believes that this is in fact a simulation (yes, like in "The Matrix"). There are people who re MORE willing to believe we were seeded by aliens than to even posit the possibility of the idea of the concept of God.
Speaking to you purely as a Theist and not as a Christian (because if I were speaking as a Christian I'd have to address the intentions of that god in regards to our creation and that would raise with it several moral issues that I don't want to address at the moment) is it COMPLETELY outside of the discussion to posit a creator? Why is it that you and I can see the same exact system but the second I suggest a designer we are no longer looking at the same thing? I believe in a consistent God and a consistent universe, so when people claim that Christians say science is taking away the mystery of the world, I counter with I don't think God wants the world to be a mystery! He gave us a world and a mind to understand that world! And I LOVE understanding it. But apparently I can't because I'm a theist. So, are we talking past each other?
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